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	<title>Comments on: The Heresy of Dual-Covenant Theology</title>
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	<link>http://brotherandre.stblogs.com/2008/01/28/the-heresy-of-dual-covenant-theology/</link>
	<description>By Brother André Marie, M.I.C.M. Dedicated to Saint Joseph the Betrothed, Patron and Protector of the Universal Church</description>
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		<title>By: Brother André Marie, M.I.C.M.</title>
		<link>http://brotherandre.stblogs.com/2008/01/28/the-heresy-of-dual-covenant-theology/comment-page-1/#comment-180</link>
		<dc:creator>Brother André Marie, M.I.C.M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 16:26:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brotherandre.stblogs.com/2008/01/28/the-heresy-of-dual-covenant-theology/#comment-180</guid>
		<description>Dear Costa,

Laudetur Iesus Christus! I read the prayer, which is doctrinally sound. Those who objected to the old prayer will likely still object to the new one. We will use this prayer here in our Good Friday liturgy. I think Father Feeny would. 

I cannot comment on the politics of other groups, including the SSPX. I don&#039;t know enough to comment, and anyway, such speculation would smack of gossip. 

The present Holy Father has done many good things for the Church. We are grateful. While some silly people want to force altar girls on traditionalists, I don&#039;t think that&#039;s what Pope Benedict would want. Ecclesia Dei will have numerous questions like this to deal with. I doubt they would impose girls upon the traditional rite. Even if they did, this would not force priests to use them. I know a priest who offers the New Rite and routinely dismisses female servers. He won&#039;t say Mass with them present. 

The &quot;Rat Trap&quot; thesis is something I have not read. I reject sedevacantism utterly and do not look for analysis of the Holy See from someone who thinks we have no pope. This is foolish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img style='float: right; margin-left: 10px;' src='http://www.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=5e8062d959767176b449fd3809c88ae7&amp;size=60&amp;default=http%3A%2F%2Fuse.perl.org%2Fimages%2Fpix.gif' alt='' />Dear Costa,</p>
<p>Laudetur Iesus Christus! I read the prayer, which is doctrinally sound. Those who objected to the old prayer will likely still object to the new one. We will use this prayer here in our Good Friday liturgy. I think Father Feeny would. </p>
<p>I cannot comment on the politics of other groups, including the SSPX. I don&#8217;t know enough to comment, and anyway, such speculation would smack of gossip. </p>
<p>The present Holy Father has done many good things for the Church. We are grateful. While some silly people want to force altar girls on traditionalists, I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s what Pope Benedict would want. Ecclesia Dei will have numerous questions like this to deal with. I doubt they would impose girls upon the traditional rite. Even if they did, this would not force priests to use them. I know a priest who offers the New Rite and routinely dismisses female servers. He won&#8217;t say Mass with them present. </p>
<p>The &#8220;Rat Trap&#8221; thesis is something I have not read. I reject sedevacantism utterly and do not look for analysis of the Holy See from someone who thinks we have no pope. This is foolish.
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		<title>By: Costa</title>
		<link>http://brotherandre.stblogs.com/2008/01/28/the-heresy-of-dual-covenant-theology/comment-page-1/#comment-179</link>
		<dc:creator>Costa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 10:28:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brotherandre.stblogs.com/2008/01/28/the-heresy-of-dual-covenant-theology/#comment-179</guid>
		<description>Dear Brother Andre Marie,

Te Deum Laudamus!

Our Solid German Rat-Papa Benedict has come through for us with the great document on true worship in the Tridentine Extraordinary Form.

I would like to thank you--Br. Andre--for your keen interest in the Divine Liturgy.  I refer to the main page of catholicism.org, which displays the GREAT glossy picture of Benedict--makes me feel so happy. I personally felt he picked the noble name Benedict, in care for your St. BENEDICT Center, for his pride of place of holding fast to Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus; but also for his love for the Liturgy which the Benedictines have so pridefully kept pure (as we see in Still River your sister Abbey headed by Abbot Gabriel Gibbs, OSB who says a very Piious Novus Ordo Liturgy with Gregorian Chants, Incense, and lots of Latin).

However, I understand that you fully support the Liturgical Disciplines of the current Congregations of Divine Worship and Ecclesia Dei? As you cited thanks for the new legislation? And of course from the Pope himself, right? I read that the 1962 Missale Romanum, which the Motu proprio &quot;Summorum Pontificum,&quot; has given religious freedom to priests to say the old rite without having to ask for permission. Something I think that is very helpful for both clergy and laity alike.

However, it seems, that there is a Motu-Trap or Rat-Trap, which one Reverend Anthony Cekada, ex-SSPX wrote on:

http://www.traditionalmass.org/articles/article.php?id=92

That Motu-Mass Trap, it seems to me, has NOW caught many cheese-lovers who do not mind the new liturgical legislation that will replace the old prayers for the Jews (which the ADL term &quot;Anti-Semitic&quot;) , I read this very interesting article online with the breaking news:

According to an unofficial translation, the prayer now reads:

&quot;Let us pray for the Jews. May the Lord our God illuminate their hearts so that they may recognize Jesus Christ savior of all men. ... Almighty and everlasting God, you who wants all men to be saved and to gain knowledge of the truth, kindly allow that, as all peoples enter into your Church, all of Israel be saved.&quot;

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_prayer_for_jews

I do not see anything unorthodox in this prayer, it is quite beautiful. I would like to see the Latin, before I jump too far, but it&#039;s fine--right? Wouldn&#039;t Fr. Leonard Feeney accept this change Or would he refuse to obey the Pope--who all must be absolutely subject to? I do not see how it is a sin to say this orthodox and pious prayer on Good Friday? Or would we have to be faithful to the traditions of our fathers and say this old prayer:

Let us pray also for the perfidious Jews: that our God and Lord would remove the veil from their hearts: that they also may acknowledge our Lord Jesus Christ.
Almighty and everlasting God, who drivest not away from Thy mercy even the perfidious Jews: hear our prayers, which we offer for the blindness of that people: that acknowledging the light of Thy truth, which is Christ, they may be rescued from their darkness. Through the same Lord Jesus they may be rescued from their darkness. Through the same Lord Jesus Holy Spirit: God, world without end. Amen.

I am wondering if the SBC will use the new prayer in divine worship? I find it ironic that a Rabbi recognized that the new prayer was fully in line with the traditional teaching &quot;Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus&quot;:

Rabbi David Rosen, a key Jewish-Vatican liaison and head of inter-religious relations at the American Jewish Committee, said he was disappointed by the new text.

&quot;It&#039;s pretty clear that there&#039;s no fullness of salvation outside the Church&quot; under the prayer&#039;s language, he said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_prayer_for_jews

So there you have it! If the new prayer for the Jews is still orthodox and unequivocally reflects the Catholic Dogma on Salvation, then, shouldn&#039;t we just swallow our pride and eat the cheese, even it is just a little moldy?

Also I am VERY curious if the SSPX will accept this new liturgical discipline? How about Bishops Fellay and Williamson, are they on the same page? And I would be shocked if the Traditionalist Regularized Orders - FSSP, OSJ, SSJV, MICM (Still River), Institute of the Good Shepherd, Institute of Christ the King, et al would refuse to obey this new order of Liturgy for Good Friday! Don&#039;t you agree? If there is any doubt, I bet EWTN will be interviewing the superiors to get a public clarification on the matter. This matter is very grave because various Jewish and Ecumenist circles want to make sure this so-called Hate Prayer is removed. And also some Traditionalists are very concerned. Also the traditional prayer would seem to allude that the Old Law has ceased.

Anyhow, I have my own doubts now if the SSPX will return to the Church in full communion. Its too bad that one change like this could ruin all the good work done up to this time to bring about Unity in Diversity. You may not want hear this, but, I heard the Rev. Cekada is influencing Bp. Williamson not to be caught in this Motu-Rat Trap. Is this really so? It seems to me, from some &quot;Murmuring&quot; going around that I heard Bp. Williamson (who is very outspoken on Judaism and denies the Holocaust) and he may be bending over toward a Sedevacantist position? Esp. if the Econe-SSPX will renounce what Bp Lefebvre was all about, and this single prayer could cause a Schism within the SSPX? Perhaps! Or maybe this has already begun?

I for one, I&#039;m simply puzzled, what are we to do? I feel trapped honestly, like you Brother, I had immediate praise and open admiration for Benedict and His Motu, but now I feel like a little simpleton mouse who is trapped between taking the traditional-looking cheese, but having to swallow the non-traditional novus ordo poison mixed inside the Latin Tridentine Liturgy; or perhaps I will have to shun the Motu totally and perhaps go totally traditional and find myself looking for a totally pre-John XXIII Mass to attend (I think mostly Sedevacantists offer those rigid rubrics like the SSPV runned by ex-SSPX Bp Kelly).

I would be very interested to know what your stance on the new Jewish Good Friday Prayers.

Thanks,
Costa

P.S. I also read that female altar servers may be allowed at the Motu Latin Mass. If that was allowed by the Pope, would you still praise the Motu Proprio?

&quot;Archdiocesan [of San Francisco] Chancellor Father Michael Padazinski emphasized that several issues and questions about Summorum Pontificum are currently before the pontifical commission Ecclesia Dei established to oversee implementation of the instruction, so the local norms might need updating in the future. Among those questions, he said, are the potential role of females as altar servers...&quot;

http://www.catholic-sf.org/FPArticle13.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img style='float: right; margin-left: 10px;' src='http://www.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=a30cef45c8610ef5cde07d9a2e961e3b&amp;size=60&amp;default=http%3A%2F%2Fuse.perl.org%2Fimages%2Fpix.gif' alt='' />Dear Brother Andre Marie,</p>
<p>Te Deum Laudamus!</p>
<p>Our Solid German Rat-Papa Benedict has come through for us with the great document on true worship in the Tridentine Extraordinary Form.</p>
<p>I would like to thank you&#8211;Br. Andre&#8211;for your keen interest in the Divine Liturgy.  I refer to the main page of catholicism.org, which displays the GREAT glossy picture of Benedict&#8211;makes me feel so happy. I personally felt he picked the noble name Benedict, in care for your St. BENEDICT Center, for his pride of place of holding fast to Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus; but also for his love for the Liturgy which the Benedictines have so pridefully kept pure (as we see in Still River your sister Abbey headed by Abbot Gabriel Gibbs, OSB who says a very Piious Novus Ordo Liturgy with Gregorian Chants, Incense, and lots of Latin).</p>
<p>However, I understand that you fully support the Liturgical Disciplines of the current Congregations of Divine Worship and Ecclesia Dei? As you cited thanks for the new legislation? And of course from the Pope himself, right? I read that the 1962 Missale Romanum, which the Motu proprio &#8220;Summorum Pontificum,&#8221; has given religious freedom to priests to say the old rite without having to ask for permission. Something I think that is very helpful for both clergy and laity alike.</p>
<p>However, it seems, that there is a Motu-Trap or Rat-Trap, which one Reverend Anthony Cekada, ex-SSPX wrote on:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.traditionalmass.org/articles/article.php?id=92" rel="nofollow">http://www.traditionalmass.org/articles/article.php?id=92</a></p>
<p>That Motu-Mass Trap, it seems to me, has NOW caught many cheese-lovers who do not mind the new liturgical legislation that will replace the old prayers for the Jews (which the ADL term &#8220;Anti-Semitic&#8221;) , I read this very interesting article online with the breaking news:</p>
<p>According to an unofficial translation, the prayer now reads:</p>
<p>&#8220;Let us pray for the Jews. May the Lord our God illuminate their hearts so that they may recognize Jesus Christ savior of all men. &#8230; Almighty and everlasting God, you who wants all men to be saved and to gain knowledge of the truth, kindly allow that, as all peoples enter into your Church, all of Israel be saved.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_prayer_for_jews" rel="nofollow">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_pray er_for_jews</a></p>
<p>I do not see anything unorthodox in this prayer, it is quite beautiful. I would like to see the Latin, before I jump too far, but it&#8217;s fine&#8211;right? Wouldn&#8217;t Fr. Leonard Feeney accept this change Or would he refuse to obey the Pope&#8211;who all must be absolutely subject to? I do not see how it is a sin to say this orthodox and pious prayer on Good Friday? Or would we have to be faithful to the traditions of our fathers and say this old prayer:</p>
<p>Let us pray also for the perfidious Jews: that our God and Lord would remove the veil from their hearts: that they also may acknowledge our Lord Jesus Christ.<br />
Almighty and everlasting God, who drivest not away from Thy mercy even the perfidious Jews: hear our prayers, which we offer for the blindness of that people: that acknowledging the light of Thy truth, which is Christ, they may be rescued from their darkness. Through the same Lord Jesus they may be rescued from their darkness. Through the same Lord Jesus Holy Spirit: God, world without end. Amen.</p>
<p>I am wondering if the SBC will use the new prayer in divine worship? I find it ironic that a Rabbi recognized that the new prayer was fully in line with the traditional teaching &#8220;Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus&#8221;:</p>
<p>Rabbi David Rosen, a key Jewish-Vatican liaison and head of inter-religious relations at the American Jewish Committee, said he was disappointed by the new text.</p>
<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s pretty clear that there&#8217;s no fullness of salvation outside the Church&#8221; under the prayer&#8217;s language, he said.</p>
<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_prayer_for_jews" rel="nofollow">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080205/ap_on_re_eu/vatican_pray er_for_jews</a></p>
<p>So there you have it! If the new prayer for the Jews is still orthodox and unequivocally reflects the Catholic Dogma on Salvation, then, shouldn&#8217;t we just swallow our pride and eat the cheese, even it is just a little moldy?</p>
<p>Also I am VERY curious if the SSPX will accept this new liturgical discipline? How about Bishops Fellay and Williamson, are they on the same page? And I would be shocked if the Traditionalist Regularized Orders &#8211; FSSP, OSJ, SSJV, MICM (Still River), Institute of the Good Shepherd, Institute of Christ the King, et al would refuse to obey this new order of Liturgy for Good Friday! Don&#8217;t you agree? If there is any doubt, I bet EWTN will be interviewing the superiors to get a public clarification on the matter. This matter is very grave because various Jewish and Ecumenist circles want to make sure this so-called Hate Prayer is removed. And also some Traditionalists are very concerned. Also the traditional prayer would seem to allude that the Old Law has ceased.</p>
<p>Anyhow, I have my own doubts now if the SSPX will return to the Church in full communion. Its too bad that one change like this could ruin all the good work done up to this time to bring about Unity in Diversity. You may not want hear this, but, I heard the Rev. Cekada is influencing Bp. Williamson not to be caught in this Motu-Rat Trap. Is this really so? It seems to me, from some &#8220;Murmuring&#8221; going around that I heard Bp. Williamson (who is very outspoken on Judaism and denies the Holocaust) and he may be bending over toward a Sedevacantist position? Esp. if the Econe-SSPX will renounce what Bp Lefebvre was all about, and this single prayer could cause a Schism within the SSPX? Perhaps! Or maybe this has already begun?</p>
<p>I for one, I&#8217;m simply puzzled, what are we to do? I feel trapped honestly, like you Brother, I had immediate praise and open admiration for Benedict and His Motu, but now I feel like a little simpleton mouse who is trapped between taking the traditional-looking cheese, but having to swallow the non-traditional novus ordo poison mixed inside the Latin Tridentine Liturgy; or perhaps I will have to shun the Motu totally and perhaps go totally traditional and find myself looking for a totally pre-John XXIII Mass to attend (I think mostly Sedevacantists offer those rigid rubrics like the SSPV runned by ex-SSPX Bp Kelly).</p>
<p>I would be very interested to know what your stance on the new Jewish Good Friday Prayers.</p>
<p>Thanks,<br />
Costa</p>
<p>P.S. I also read that female altar servers may be allowed at the Motu Latin Mass. If that was allowed by the Pope, would you still praise the Motu Proprio?</p>
<p>&#8220;Archdiocesan [of San Francisco] Chancellor Father Michael Padazinski emphasized that several issues and questions about Summorum Pontificum are currently before the pontifical commission Ecclesia Dei established to oversee implementation of the instruction, so the local norms might need updating in the future. Among those questions, he said, are the potential role of females as altar servers&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.catholic-sf.org/FPArticle13.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.catholic-sf.org/FPArticle13.htm</a>
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